Thursday, June 28, 2012
From an Amarr
I was moderating some comments when a comment from Cearain popped up. I thought it justified more specific responses, so I’m going to post it here. My responses will be in red.
Let me follow han's advice and not talk in terms of groups be they "bitter amarr vets" "Fweddit FWodder" or "minmatar." There are issues that everyone who has been playing this game can readilly see:
Fweddit FWodder? Wow, I had not yet heard that one. That just seems mean…
1) The plexing is not sufficiently pvp centered. I have been pushing to have this addressed for years. I kept getting the response that once plexing has consequences people will fight over them. Well now finally people are realizing that is not really the case. There are many proposals that will help on this issue. Timer count down if you get kicked from a plex. Also notifications of who enters or exits plexes so players can react. Etc.
Yeah, me and Hans have gotten into huge discussions about this. We both agree that the whole *point* of plexes should be pvp.
I noticed a huge influx of pvp in plexes right around Inferno, but then it seemed to taper off again after that point…
What do you think about reducing the ‘circumference’ of the button –ie: instead of 10K, 20K, and 30K make it 5K, 10K, and 15K, and then significantly shortening the distance between the button and the warp-in? Say 20K-30K between instead of 50K-80K.This would make speed tanking harder, since you would have to stay within a tighter space, and it would greatly increase the risk of people coming in and being able to more easily and quickly point you. (Instead of having to boat 70K to even get to you, by which point most people can just run away…even if they’re in a bigger ship…)
2) Plexing for minmatar is much easier than for amarr.
To be honest, I’ll have to take your word on it. Even in the year I was in Amarr I never did one plex!
If speed tanking wasn’t an issue would this still be true? Would it still be harder to run the plex normally?
And why is it harder? Because of the weapons they use, or something else? Have you noticed any difference since they removed ewar?
Lets fix these 2 issues and faction war will be much much better. I think very few who follow this blog would not agree these two things are problems.
Now other issues have been raised and I think there is considerable disagreement on these issues:
1) Whether goons helped minmatar very much. Some help yes but not much. Minmatar can easilly get the @6 mill lp needed to bring them from tier 1 to tier 5. They will likely do this again. They don't need to stay there long. Just long enough to cash out their lp!
2) Whether amarr can come back. I think we can due to the no lp for defensive plexing rule. However amarr are simply not employing strategies to use that rule to our advantage. We keep flipping systems right next the minmatar bases and feeding them lp! This is dumb and we have no one to blame but ourselves.
The caldari seem to be much more organized and frankly smarter from a occupancy plexing perspective. Amarr got this idea of defending some sort of "pipeline" early on. Nothing is being piped through this pipeline because eve mechanics don't work like world war 1. But nonetheless old strategies seem to die hard.
I think the Amarr can come back too. And I think that employing some smarter strategies could very well be a big part of doing that. It will be interesting to see what happens. =)
3) Whether the lp disparaty is too large. I tink it is not too large. Given that no lp for defensive plexing is given the amarr could easilly turn the tables on the minmatar by not actually taking systems but leaving them vulnerable. This is what we see caldari and gallente doing. And yes its because they are smart about plexing.
After the amarr get the upper hand then minmatar will be able to flip it back. And this flip flopping is how all people in faction war will be able to afford top notch ships and fittings to continue the war. These large rewards gives us reason to plex and to defend plexes. (note by defend plexes I do not mean defensive plexing. I mean fighting enemies who try to plex in your space)
Interesting perspective. I think we’re going to have to agree to disagree with the whole defensive plexing. I think the fact we have less systems to LP for ISK in condenses our ‘farmers’ and makes it easier for us to take systems in the long run.
However, if the Amarr simply refuse to take a bunker and leave something vulnerable, I’m not really sure how the Minmatar would respond, so you may be onto something where that’s concerned. They can barely be asked to defensively plex in systems they live in let alone other places…so…it could be interesting…
4) Station lockouts. IMO this was stupid and remains stupid. And yes it is annoying to hear hans or even fweddit say its no big deal. Neither was effected by this change! As far aw I know fweddit is still based outside faction war and they have no idea how great it was from a pvp perspective to have the stations open thoughout the warzone. Lockouts simply makes it harder for the side with fewer systems to field pvp fleets.
For a casual gamer like me who will never again base out of faction war unless ccp undoes this rule it is not at all a reason to fight. I don't care if kamela falls from a docking perspective. Tuomuta is right next to it and I used to base out of there anyway. I still have a bunch of stuff there in fact. However not being able to reship in frerstorn or arzad sucks and has cost me plenty of fights. It has also made the war zone blob up in and around kourm. I would love to see the percentages of fw pvp that take place in all the fw systems in april compared to june. I think you will find the pvp was much more spread out in april with lots of small gangs rolling througout the faction war zone. People who just joined faction war after inferno simply didn't get a chance to understand how great that was.
Okay, okay. I also haven’t thought of it as a big deal, but then again I didn’t have to move, and I haven’t yet been gotten locked out of anything important.
When push comes to shove, I’m not sure I care either way about the station docking issue at this point. While I think it’s interesting to have some sort of home court advantage in your own home systems, I also like the idea of facilitating small gang pvp by not creating a system that polarizes people into certain systems, as you are saying. I’m going to have to think that one over for a while.
Also, thanks for your comments Cearain. I don’t always follow your logic, and I don’t always agree with you, but I do appreciate discussion on game mechanics and responses to various ideas.
EDIT: Adding a link to Pinky's Blog who responds to the topics.